You've said previously in this call that you are working on that and winding it down.

I mean, it's an option, but it's not my favorite option.

And I don't want to say I say things that you want to hear,

but I know you would want that, but I don't know how I feel after.

I know you do.

This is why I don't feel like I don't even trust anything you say anymore

because for everything it's like that.

It's like you just say it because to get off your case.

I guess you've got to come to some sort of compromise.

You know, there's got to be a meeting point somewhere.

I don't think that getting rid of it is worth it financially.

I think we've got better opportunity, but it doesn't have to be as big as it was before.

And it can be something that allows space and time for other things to develop.

Providing a routine backdrop, not a huge amount of money,

but something.

And coming in to cover debts and basic living costs

while allowing time to do other things and have other plans develop.

And you're not managing to break even.

You know, it's not.

Sorry, Liz.

No problem.

I was about to say, it sounds like, Ben, you were talking about downsizing.

Yeah.

Yeah, making it easy.

I mean, it's already smaller now.

It is quite easy.

Sometimes I do feel frustrated.

You know, when Grandad retired, Damone came in, we talked about it.

And it is a bit risky.

It requires capital.

It requires hard work.

Then things changed again with Damone Coin.

And I feel like, well, this is what we signed up for from the beginning

with the long-run benefit to come from it.

And the freedom to shape it the way that we would want.

And not just turn around and say,

oh, just close the doors and don't bother.

Yeah, but I hear you.

But I just, it's not making any money.

It's just to say covering its bills.

It's not making me a good amount of money at all.

Definitely.

Do you see that changing then?

Do you see that could improve?

Yes.

Okay.

But not without investment, which we're not in a position to do.

Okay.

So, trust in that because it's, we've said that before and we've put,

it wasn't just Damone who put the money.

How much?

I don't even know how much your mom and I put and you put loads and loads of money.

And it's just gone.

Probably 100K or more.

I don't know.

I just, there is no clear answer what's happened to all that.

Yeah, I get Damone took his money out.

And this is why I'm thinking if you do a business in technology,

I just don't know how much it's going to cost.

Yeah, I agree.

But I have nothing to start from with that, do I?

Just some.

But you do.

You don't need anything to start for technology.

You need to go and start talking to people.

Okay.

Because you even have the products and all that.

And you just need to scale it slowly.

I don't know if I do.

I just don't know why you don't want that.

I do want that.

I don't know where to start.

Maybe we should spend our time talking about that instead sometimes.

Well, we should, but I feel like you don't want that.

But you're not interested because when I start talking to you about it, this isn't relevant to our lives.

Yeah, but you start talking to me explaining the technical details.

How everything works and I always say, well, what's the point in that?

You sit till 1 a.m. all the time just developing.

No, I don't.

I really don't.

And I don't feel a compassion for those.

And it's...

I'm frustrated because I think you should be spending your time thinking about the business side of things.

But I do.

I really feel like you don't...

You have no interest in that whatsoever.

And you say that, what's the relevance to our lives?

Well, we could make it relevant to our lives.

Can you see the lawnmower guy?

He's got England flags on his lawnmower.

But he doesn't look very English.

Okay.

No, I can't see it.

From the window.

How do you come to a compromise over whatever's happening with your work?

Well, it is your work and your stress.

It is shared.

And I don't know how transparent you both are with money.

But you know everything about what's coming in and what's going out.

But maybe that might be...

A place to start.

Thank you.